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Profile: pimpske
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Blog: Religion and the Afterlife
Posted at 09-21-2009 09:33
One of the things i love to do above all is contemplation and understanding. And, during one of my journey's through my thoughts i stumbled across something i found very interesting. However, to fully explain this theory, i'll go through my entire thought process. I encourage anybody to make counter statements and arguments (But only thought driven ones). I am, unofficially a scholar and a ??? so i love to hear the thoughts and opinions of others.
To start, a while back i was talking to a friend, who mentioned somewhere in the conversation that all things happen for a reason. This was in context with the rest of the conversation but i do not remember much else about it. This got me thinking
Most, if not all religions that have a God, believe that all things happen for a reason. That their God has a divine plan that everything fits into, and is a good plan. So, if all things happen for a reason, then ALL things happen for a reason. There is no 50/50 in this case, its an all or nothing deal.
Also - God (I will use this as a general term for all religions with this believe) is a good being, who loves his children entirely. And that God is just, and does not punish anybody wrongly, even if it feels as if one is being punished at the time for seemingly no reason.
So, if we can say that God is just, and that everything that happens in the world is done for a good reason, even if it does not seem so at the time, then Hell cannot exist in the definition that most religions say it does.
For example, If a man kills another man simply because he feels like it, this may look like a random act of violence with no good side to it. But if the father/son/friend ect. of the killed man takes it upon himself to rid the world of all evil then this could be construed as a good thing. Now, 1 death of a good man = 50 deaths of bad men.
However if God loves all his children then this would seem even worse. But, as all things happen for a "Good" reason, then this may cause the entire world to fall into an era of peace because of realization that death is a terrible thing. I know, this is not a great example, but it is, none the less, an example.
So, it would be said that all those evil people would go to hell and burn for all eternity because they were bad people. But, as all things happen for a reason, then they too were bad men for a reason. And if all reasons happen for the grand plan that is ultimately good, then they were bad men for a good reason.
And, as God is just, he would not punish those who did a good thing. It just doesn't make sense.
I have come to the conclusion that Hell may very well be an awful place, but not in the exact same way that religion says.
I am strong in the belief that there is a God, there is a Heaven, and there is a Hell. However, unlike what most religions say, it is not a definite destination. It would make sense, given the description of God, if Hell is a mer pit-stop on the road to eternal life and happiness.
A place to stop to reflect on your life and understand what you did, and learn where your life fits into the grand plan.
I'm sure i did a terrible job in explaining my idea, but when i think, its very erratic, so typing down my thoughts in an orderly fashion can some times be difficult.
Again, i welcome any counter arguments and discussion. Please keep it civil, logical, and friendly. Quoting a single bible or other holy book phrase as a single proof will get no-where and i will delete your comment. However, if you use a phrase and comment on it, explaining your position and why it is relevant, that is fully acceptable. Please keep an open mind about this. Again, anybody posting comments saying they know the answer 100% will be deleted. I've come to realize that nobody, regardless of how much they think they do, knows the answer to the afterlife. It is purely down to belief, and trust.
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(27) Comments | 642 Views
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game chicken 
Posted on: 09-23-2009 21:58
well if there is life after death you would know but if there isn't you wouldn't so it all comes down to is there a god? |
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thestarbird 
Posted on: 09-24-2009 04:27
there's no need to try to make somebody believe or disbelieve in God or any other diety. People have their reasons for believing or not. Many people believe just because it is a safety net. Many people don't believe because it doesn't make sense to them.
When people learn to allow people to believe what they want to believe, then that is when real peace will come. I believe in God, but I also am contemplating the existence of demi-gods or lesser gods. I have two reasons to believe this.
1. Lucifer was an Angel with the power to match God's. It wasn't until Lucifer challenged God and lost to him that he became known as Satan and was given the name and reputation as being the king of evil. If Lucifer was one who had that power, what's not to say that there aren't others who have such powers but God keeps them in check?
2. The 1st Commandment says "Thou shalt have no other gods BEFORE me." To me, that means that there are possibly other gods but you have to see HIM as the God of Gods. This commandment is followed by the 2nd "Thou shalt not make any graven image by thy hand." This one seems a bit looser, but to me it means not to create false Gods or idols. So, the two commandments together say to worship him first, but have no other false Gods.
To me, it means that there may be many other gods with Him as the God of Gods... but I cannot prove it and even if I could, I cannot possibly find the other gods without risking making false gods.
But that is what I believe... we all believe what we want to. When we respect that, you'll find that anger and hatred seem to melt away. |
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GamerMan 
Posted on: 09-24-2009 16:44
3 things the human mind is not powerful enough to contemplate:
Death, The size of the universe and the past.
And i dont mean 100 years ago, I mean the origin of religions. If god is the almighty, then why is there not only 1 religion? Where more created to challenge this religion of Christianity? Can you trust the word of god? Is the possibility of the commandments being 100% original not next to impossible?
If you are going to live your life by the Bible, then surely you must have to trust it.
You guys aren't really questioning the religion, you guys are questioning happenings within religion, and coming up with an answer that still sticks to your religion. |
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thestarbird 
Posted on: 09-25-2009 03:41
who said we had to question our religion? we believe because we choose so. you bring up good points, but I will admit that standing on the outside looking in, it is a lot easier to come up with arguments and questions. part of being a part of any religion and then actually contemplating whether it is right or not is always an internal struggle with what you were brought up to believe. in other words, it is easier to go from not believing to believing in something than from going to believing to not believing. that is why many religions focus MORE on bringing non-believers into their religion than maintaining their current flock. I don't agree with it, but that is what they do.
I believe fully that the bible has been mistranslated about a billion times from the original scripts. for the longest time the only people who could read the bible were the priests, so of course the priests could say and translate the bible however they wanted to. when the bible was translated from latin to english and any other languages, the original translators very easily could have translated it to their advantages. it is sad really, but that's what elitism has always been. those with the power can rewrite history. |
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pimpske 
Posted on: 09-25-2009 07:13
Demi-Gods - I had thought on this a while back too. And, with the whole moses and the pharaoh bit. The priests of the Egyptian gods do crazy things, but then the Jewish god always out-does them. And it says that God wanted to prove he was more powerful than any other Gods. So again it does kind of look like there are other gods. And, while its impossible to understand God's motives, its entertaining to try and decipher some of the messages.
GM and SB - Sb was right, its very hard to disbelieve something after being brought up to believe it. Especially when they take particular pleasure in emphasizing how awful hell is. No mater what that image of eternal death and pain is always ingrained in your brain no mater how stupid it is. And while i don't understand why you chose not to believe, I'll respect that. But mind you, i've chosen to believe not because i have to, or because i'm supposed to, but because i've come to the conclusion that God is the only logical reason for life.
The human brain is wired to recognize intelligent creation. When you see writing on the wall, you recognize that as a creation and not a random event. You see a sky-scraper, and you realize some one built that. You see an arrowhead in the dirt, and you realize some body created that. However, most of science has shunned the idea of intelligence in anything other than what we ourselves make. Which is crippling in the advancement of man.
What makes me laugh all the time though, is when people say we were planted here by aliens. Now, i'm not going to say this is wrong because i don't know. But whenever i ask the question "Did we evolve, or is there a God" i always get at least one person saying we were planted by aliens. So, when i ask them where the aliens came from, they don't know what to say, some times they say they were planted by aliens. However they never seem to realize the paradox they are creating for themselves. |
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Visigoth 
Posted on: 09-25-2009 08:09
Too much information to completely respond to, but I did want to say something in regards to Lucifer being an equal to God. I disagree with this. Yes, he challenged God, and being one of the elite Seraphim, there is no doubt that he had power, but I don't believe he was an equal to his creator. He may have saw himself as such, but I don't think he actually was.
You could even say he still serves God. He's bound to Hell, and he punishes the ones who don't make it into Heaven... sounds like he still serves God to me.
In the words of Dr. Edward Conklin:
"The probability of life originating from accident is comparable to the probability of the unabridged dictionary resulting from an explosion in a printing shop."
I think that's all I will say on the subject, as I don't come on often enough to engage properly in this discussion. |
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GamerMan 
Posted on: 09-25-2009 08:26
But pimspke, someone has told you this, someone has given you this picture of Hell and told you it's bad. Is it logical to believe that this is correct? |
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thestarbird 
Posted on: 09-25-2009 13:49
visigoth: I do see your point in satan being a servent of God. The bible claims that God puts us through trials and temptation throughout our lives, but these "evils" that try to lead us astray are supposedly coming from Satan. So I believe that you are right here... Satan is now but a tool for God and may not be his enemy.
One thing that gets me though (back on the topic of sin). The bible says that jealousy is a sin, but the bible also says that God is a jealous God... does that mean that God has sinned? |
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